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'fairly' novel design

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bob walton View Drop Down
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    Posted: 24 June 2017 at 2:34pm
Some people have told me that there is nothing novel here. A head set that leans backwards isn't new, and neither is using a linkage from the handlebars to the front wheel. But I haven't seen one like this and I was actually really happy the way it turned out. You can never tell when you start a project if it will finish up OK. Here it is anyway. The local lads around here said it was 'sick', which is apparently yoof speak for good. 'Bad' also means good, also 'wicked'. I digress....



Edited by GeoffBird - 24 June 2017 at 6:04pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GeoffBird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 6:08pm
Looks like it handles well Bob. There were some Dutch low-racers that had a reverse rake head tube and remote steering but I can't remember what they were called. There is a Velo Vision article about them somewhere...

Here is my design with a vertical steering head and remote steering:

 


Edited by GeoffBird - 24 June 2017 at 6:18pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bob walton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 24 June 2017 at 11:21pm
blimey, that's a fabulous looking thing. I was trying to keep mine a simple as possible and just use off the shelf components. I thought a very soft seat might be simpler than suspension but its a bit harsh when you go down a curb. I think you were aiming higher than me! Are you happy with the way your bike goes? Is it easy to ride? And what will you make next, or do you think this is this the pinnacle? If I did another one I would try to lighten it instead of just using square section mild steel -  and do a boingier seat. I like simplicity, but your build quality puts me to shame.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GeoffBird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 25 June 2017 at 6:53pm
Thanks Bob. Many aspects of the design work well, but over all I'd say it is a bit of a failure. It is very heavy and pretty slow. No doubt the fairings I had planned for it would make it quicker but I'd rather start from a more efficient base. I'm not clear yet why it is slow but simplicity and light weight are always preferable in a bicycle. Your design looks very usable as a medium to short-range machine. Suspension is nice - hard to go back to a bike without it, especially with the road surfaces around here!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote legs_larry Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 12:18pm
Originally posted by GeoffBird GeoffBird wrote:

Looks like it handles well Bob. There were some Dutch low-racers that had a reverse rake head tube and remote steering but I can't remember what they were called. There is a Velo Vision article about them somewhere...


And closer to home there was Dave Richards' Kestrel, which was just about the sweetest-handling bike I ever rode.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GeoffBird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 3:59pm
Yes, I forgot that one Dave, although that had a vertical headset IIRC. Fiona owned Sherri's sister bike to DR's machine for a while. I found it a bit twitchy, but I replaced the steering joints with some better ones which helped a bit. I also rode a one-off that Peter Ross built with the same setup. Then there was the Streetglider from Future Cycles in Winnie the Pooh country, which I never rode.

All these bikes (including mine) display very steady low-speed handling (walking pace) and a lack of tendency to fall into corners that recumbents with conventional steering geometry have. But cornering-wise, a 10 degree head angle works even better (Derrick's Fast Donkey and my T-7 - both with direct steering), with most of the low-speed benefits of a vertical head angle. Of course, these conclusions are subjective and based on a low sample.

The remote steering adds weight, complexity and can get in the way of your legs (as on my T-9, pictured above, although it has a fairly low Q-factor). For these reasons, my next one will probably have direct steering but with as steep a head angle as possible without introducing too much tiller effect. I find bikes with lots of tiller effect (big offset between hands and steering axis) very unpleasant - You have to be in a Zen-like state to ride them smoothly...


Edited by GeoffBird - 26 June 2017 at 4:03pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bob walton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 6:40pm
I've googled some of the bikes you mentioned but can't see one that looks like mine, even if some bikes have some of the same features. I thought it was simple and easy to get on with. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GeoffBird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 8:24pm
I certainly can't think of any long wheelbase bikes with a reverse rake head tube. Mike Burrows' LWB Ratcatcher had a vertical head tube. There was a production LWB bike designed by a German professor that had a very similar layout but conventional steering geometry (but rubber band suspension), but I can't for the life of me think of the name of it.

You'll have to bring your bike along to a BHPC meeting so we can have a go Bob. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote bob walton Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 8:29pm
where's that then - and when?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote GeoffBird Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 26 June 2017 at 8:54pm
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